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27 May 2011 @ 09:43 am
Discussion of Marriage, poly rel, in Battlestar  
So here's the thing: I'm writing a Kara/Sam/Lee triad marriage/relationship epic. (based on This bit of porn . And I'm trying to do it the bsg-way - or how it might have gone in canon.

And since I didn't actually ever watch Caprica, I have a few questions relating in a general way for flisters who watched it. Plus some bsg discussion.

ON MAWWIAGE ..




We didn't get much in the way of multiples in bsg - Baltar and his harem, and his triad on the basestar. given that, and other hints, it seems that frakking around, without marriage, isn't a big deal. And although we didn't see much, what we did see suggests that same-sex relationships were no different culturally.

However marriage seems to be more serious and different from frakking around. Both Kara and Lee cite being married in EOJ (Lee holds up infidelity as something impermissible, but Kara is from Ellen's school of marriage is forever, but infidelity is no big thing). But it's pretty clear that both of them think marriage changes them from what they were before and it's important in some basic way. I don't think THAT would change in a threesome marriage. Anyway, I've already written how they figure it out.

But what I'm most interested in right now is what everyone's else's reaction is going to be when our three get involved in this way. My thinking is that most people don't care -- in the Colonies, particularly in more cosmopolitan Caprica, poly marriages are rare but not unheard of, and not specifically banned by the Scrolls. So K/L/S might get some side-eyeing and raised eyebrows, but not much worse than that.

OTOH:
I know there was a polygamous relationship (marriage? Was it actually referred to as such?) in Caprica (the show). what was the makeup? (i.e. one girl & two guys) Were they monotheists? Or a LoK group?

Because it occurred to me that if poly was something that the monotheists were doing... well, since we don't hear about non-Cylon monotheism, it must be pretty non-standard in 'modern" Colonies. So I'm thinking they must have taken a hit (in members, in blame, whatev, to reduce their legitimacy) during/after the Cylon War. IOW if they become a dismissible cult of only a few, that no one admits even exists and is driven underground, then it seems likely their institutions did as well, which would create more prejudice against any future poly marriage. ("Poly marriage is something only gods-less heathens do!" That sort of thing)

Or poly might be something even more strictly forbidden by certain branches of LoK faith. Sagittarons are the ones in TWK with the 'no modern medicine' thing, and gemenon are the anti-abortionists, IIRC -- though neither of those necessarily would have to have a problem with poly rels, I don't think. It's convenient to pile on the prejudice, I suppose, but not necessary, I suppose it could be an association thing -- maybe the gemenonese are actually polygamists, so anyone who is also doing it gets tarred with their same crazy by the casually religious...)

I don't need for this to be overly complicated or difficult for our heroes - it would be better if it's not, since they have enough to deal with and I don't really want to write a Very Special Episode of why Prejudice is Bad, BUT otoh, too easy is, well, too easy and that's not how this show rolls. It seems likely that somebody wouldn't like it -- I just don't know who and why...

So, tl;dr:
if you have done any thinking on this, or there are some other details from Caprica that I'd find useful, I'd love to know.



U HAZ THOUGHTS?

And also, I now seem to be in need of a K/S/L icon. Anyone?
 
 
 
The Proverbial Bull in a China Shop...: BSG girls' night outsabaceanbabe on May 27th, 2011 04:52 pm (UTC)
What I remember of the poly marriage in Caprica was that there were a whole buncha wives and husbands and they all seemed to more or less revolve around one woman, who was like the main spouse. I *think* they were based on Gemenon, but it didn't seem to be anything that made off-worlders look at them askance. As for religion, she was a monotheist, but I don't recall if any of her husbands or wives also self-identified that way.

I don't know if that changed the final episodes, since I lost track of it and then never got to watching them before the DVR deleted them for space.
lizardbeth: Kara-Anders IIlizardbeth_j on May 27th, 2011 05:12 pm (UTC)
hrm. so it was open? and nobody cared who knew? and if a huge multi like that is okay (and not considered, I dunno, cultish), then a basic triad would be like a blip.

which is nice, but ... seems a little bit weird for bsg... nobody is allowed to have nice things, after all... :)

The Proverbial Bull in a China Shop...: Sam Anderssabaceanbabe on May 27th, 2011 06:25 pm (UTC)
It seemed open to me, but then my attention did tend to wander... :P
klaetificat on May 27th, 2011 05:26 pm (UTC)
Sister Clarice was in a poly marriage. From what I can recall it was out of the ordinary (as Lacey seemed a little surprised and unfamiliar with the concept when she visited Clarice), but it otherwise looks completely accepted and legal. I got the feeling that the poly/threesome marriage was particularly Caprican, with Caprica being the most permissive of all of the colonies that we've seen, but yes, it had the same weight of marriage as Kara thought.

Also, from what I recall, the monotheists didn't change their cultural pretexts when they changed from polytheism.

I think we didn't see any out-of-the-box marriages/relationships in BSG simply because the writers hadn't completely developed their ideas for Caprica, which was much more an American analogue during BSG than it appeared in Caprica.
lizardbeth: Anders - Leelizardbeth_j on May 27th, 2011 05:52 pm (UTC)
I think we didn't see any out-of-the-box marriages/relationships in BSG simply because the writers hadn't completely developed their ideas for Caprica

oh yes, this for obv Tho then that raises certain continuity issues that require some handwaving if Caprica is really supposed to be past-history to Battlestar. Like, does Caprica/the Colonies then get less permissive in the wake of the Cylon war , which is kind of the implication I think,if you go in chronological order.

So anyway, I'm just trying to figure out if Kara/Sam/Lee are gonna be smooth sailing for the general public on their relationship, or if there'd be anyone who would actively be against it

Or heh, maybe the 'problem' is that it's publicly fascinating- these are after all three celebrities in a bit of a scandalous relationship. They might have to deal more with reporters than people who want to beat them up...
klaetificat on May 27th, 2011 05:56 pm (UTC)
Exactly -- if Caprica's permissive culture was seen to many to be a reason why the Cylons prospered, then it's likely that the culture Kara and Lee grew up is exactly as you think, although everyone *does* seem perfectly okay with frakking around. Unfortunately we'll never know...

Definitely reporters. I think the Capricans would probably not think it entirely *too* scandalous, although it would be notable, but the Gemenese and some of the other conservative colonies may throw a fit.

I always saw the Colonial fleet as being something like a small town. Everyone will end up knowing what everyone else is doing sooner or later. :)
Merry Fivanolix on May 28th, 2011 12:26 am (UTC)
Sister Clarice was like the "head" wife in a marriage that had at least 1 other wife and 2 husbands. Lacy was a little unfamiliar with the concept, but not only was she a teenager but her reaction was more of a "Oh I've heard about this but it's kind of exotic to me". I believe she mentioned that she'd known children at school who came from poly families. None of the adults seemed awkward with Clarice's family, though, so I hazard that it was untraditional but not "weird".

That being said, it was a monotheist thing, at least as far as we could see on the show... And also, societies often regress to a conservative state after a huge crisis. My guess would be that what we saw in Caprica the show was the liberal state of the planet/colonies, and that after the Cylon war things tightened up a bit. However, it was only one generation back, so I don't think K/S/L would face a "You're doing WHAT???" reaction...more of a "uh...okay >_>" one.
lizardbeth: Kara-Anders  Resistancelizardbeth_j on May 28th, 2011 06:43 am (UTC)
Since y'all agree with my first instinct I'll stick with that (apparently fannish osmosis re: Caprica, was even better than I expected!) A little side-eyeing, and maybe more for the gossip of the marriage itself than it's a threesome. Like I said up top it's not as if they don't have plenty to deal with, without people trying to shun them or whatever. I don't think the three of them care about people looking at them funny anyway. The only one whose opinion matters to them is probably Bill.

... crap, I had something more I was planning on mentioning but it got lost in the wilds of tumblr. If I think of it (or reach it in the fic), I'll try again. but thanks!
herald_mari: lilah wanna playherald_mari on May 28th, 2011 10:21 am (UTC)
I'm afraid fandom-wise I have nothing to add...except my mind went "PRETTY!" at the thought of a K/L/S (actually, with Lee as the pivot point it'd be damn pretty!) But L/K/S would work, too...